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Jackie Kinder is a an Attorney and Principal at Watters, Wolf, Bub, and Hansmann. She’s a trial lawyer with a track record of success defending individuals and corporations in complex personal injury lawsuits.
She talks to Cynthia about the path to her legal career, which started quite early. She details her many experiences in going to trial, navigating single-motherhood as a top performing professional, and her philosophy on success.
1 – Introduction 00:23
2 – Current Role 01:05
3 – How did you become an attorney 03:05
4 – Why so few women lawyers 06:20
5 – Difference between corporate law and litigation 07:49
6 – Do you think a desire to litigate is innate 13:11
7 – Importance of a supportive partner at home 17:03
8 – What did you do to get the support you needed 18:16
9 – How do we ask for the help we need 21:10
10 – Women always trying to do everything 23:19
11 – Knowing limitations 25:28
12 – Not having to drive to the office 29:21
13 – Were there challenges to navigate as a female? 30:00
14 – How about asking questions to male client 35:36
15 – The psychology of when to be more aggressive on examination 36:50
16 – What are some challenges you faced as a female leader 38:54
17 – Being more approachable 43:30
18 – How do you train your brain to be compassionate 46:38
19 – How did you figure out you wanted to be a litigator? 50:30
20 – Big case that stands out 56:29
21 – Who were some of your great mentors or advisors 1:01:39
22 – How did you learn to adapt as a female in those roles 1:05:14
23 – What it’s like to help young females coming up 1:06:55
24 – What’s it like to become partner at a big firm? 1:07:53
25 – How did the firm breakup come about for you 1:11:03
26 – Last words, put this at the end 1:14:18
27 – Who do you help? 1:15:13
28 – Ending again 1:16:36
Content Notice
This podcast and all She Lift Project content represents the opinions of Cynthia Kirkpatrick and her guests. The content here is for informational purposes only, and should not be taken as professional advice – financial, legal, medical, or otherwise.
Views and opinions expressed in the podcast and across all She Lift Project media channels are our own and do not represent that of our places of work. While we make every effort to ensure that the information we are sharing is accurate, we welcome any comments, suggestions, or correction of errors.
“Young Shannon became an overachiever because she was a people pleaser. She needed to please others. And so that really developed in my adulthood as well. “
“They say, I’m still working 60, 80 hours a week. I got into this so I could pick my kids up from school and so I could attend their soccer games that are after school and I haven’t been able to attend one. I got into this so that we could go on great family vacations. And I haven’t been on a vacation now in five years. More people are coming to us for those reasons…it’s the lifestyle sacrifices that are causing people more pain than taking home a paycheck that isn’t what they thought it would be.”
It’s not about me selling and, you know, me making money. It’s about you being satisfied and happy with what you want and what you need. And I’ve always had that kind of philosophy, and my dad had that, too. And people recognize you’re not in it for yourself, you’re in it for them. And you’re sincere, and it really goes a long way.
Leadership is not about the leader. And I equate this back to basketball. When you have coach or coaches, they can’t go out on the court and shoot the ball and dribble the ball and pass the ball. But coaches have to be really good at getting work done through others. And so from a leadership perspective, that’s how I see it. As a leader, I have to be really good at getting work done through others.
“Gallup just got done with their survey for 2022. They found 25% better profitability in companies that have great employee cultures. Because when you have happy employees, happy employees make your customers happy. Happy employees want to invite other people to come work at their company. Happy employees want to share their ideas to make the company better. All of a sudden, you’ve created this culture where people want to contribute, and that’s the reason we do what we do.”
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